Butt-Slapping gets Boys in Trouble
Posted by shadmia on July 25, 2007
Cory Mashburn and Ryan Cornelison, two 13-year-old boys ran down the hallway of Patton Middle School after lunch, slapping as many girl’s butts as they could get their hands on along the way. A teacher’s aid caught them and sent them to the office. The vice principal, Steve Tillery, and a police officer, Marshall Roache, stationed at the school, questioned the boys and some of the girls involved in the incident. Apparently convinced that a crime had been committed, the officer read the boys their Miranda rights and hauled them off in handcuffs to juvenile jail, where they spent the next five days. Now, Cory Mashburn and Ryan Cornelison, face the prospect of 10 years in juvenile detention and a lifetime on the sex offender registry. Read the Original Charges here. The charges against both Cory Mashburn and Ryan Cornelison were later amended and the felony charges against Cory were dropped.
Bradley Berry, the McMinnville district attorney, said his office “aggressively” pursues sex crimes that involve children. “These cases are devastating to children,” he said. “They are life-altering cases.”
“The disproportionality of the charges is absurd,” said Phillip Esplin, a forensic psychologist who has researched child sex abuse for the National Institutes of Health.
“My question is, why this would constitute a sexual offense, as opposed to something inappropriate that should have been dealt with within the school — not within the criminal justice system.”
To Rhonda Pope, mother of Christian Richter, 13, a girl named in the court papers as one of the victims, the charges are justified.
“Slapping somebody on the butt is sexual harassment, and it is a crime,” she said. “Considering what was going on and that my daughter was offended, it is a crime. And it’s not OK.”
Insisting that the charges are an overreaction, Mashburn’s attorney, Mark Lawrence, has worked to bring as much public attention as possible to the story. Lawrence, himself a former Yamhill County prosecutor, and his client briefly appeared on commentator Bill O’Reilly’s cable TV show.
“I look at this from a prosecutor’s perspective and a defense attorney’s perspective, and believe this is truly insane. I do not condone this behavior — it was inappropriate. But it is not criminal.”
Marshall Roache, the police officer, after conducting a follow up interview with many of the girls was told that it was “slap butt day” and many of them were involved in the same behavior including one girl who described it as “a handshake we do.” Two of the alleged victims said they had swatted boys’ buttocks themselves. No one claimed to be offended by the horseplay. At this point the two boys were still locked up.
The next day the juvenile court held a hearing on whether the boys should be released. The courtroom was packed with Patton students and families of both boys — many were crying. The boys were there, too, in shackles and jail outfits. Two of the alleged victims spontaneously offered to testify on behalf of the boys. Under oath, they told the judge they were friends and did not feel threatened by them. The two girls also testified they felt compelled, during the initial interviews with Tillery and Roache, to say things that weren’t true. Read a copy of the court transcript here.
“Well, when the (vice) principal asked me stuff, I kind of felt pressured to answer stuff that I was uncomfortable, and that it hurt, but it really didn’t,” the girl said, explaining that she didn’t think anything sexual went on.
The boys were released. But the judge ordered them out of school, required constant parental supervision and barred them from contacting friends. Any deviation, he said, would result in more time in juvenile jail. The boys and their parents were interviewed about the experience. Watch the Video Clip Here
The only “victims” in this entire incident were the two boys and their families. Because of their horseplay, two boys have been thrown in jail for days, enduring what must have been a nightmare for both of them. Now their parents are suffering under the expense of having to hire lawyers to defend their children. Both boys are under house arrest and are not able to return to school. They are facing some very serious charges that could land them in jail for a very long time. And in addition they may have to register as sex offenders and be included in that registry for the rest of their lives. All this over an incident in which no one claims to be a victim and no one is afraid of these two 13-year-olds, who were just having some fun with their friends during the lunch break at school. When will some sanity return to the “adults” who try to make young sexual predators out of boys just having fun??? Can someone tell them to BUTT out and let kids be kids!!!
July 25, 2007 at 6:13 am
ABSURD!!
July 25, 2007 at 6:50 am
Was what they did wrong? Yes. Do they deserve to pay for it the rest of their lives as being registered sex offenders? No. A fine and some time in detention should be suffice
July 25, 2007 at 7:10 am
I cannot believe this normal ’stuff’ kids do, could make these boys registered sex offenders for LIFE. Someone is getting paid way tooo much $ if this is the ‘most’ important crimes they have to prosecute. Listen UP …. GET A LIFE !!! Or, better yet, go look for people that go home after a long day at a real job, and kick their dog, or their wife and kids…. these are real crimes ….
July 25, 2007 at 7:16 am
I think the legal system is going overboard. This is so ridiculous there are not words for it. Not so many years(well maybe a few:o) ) we were kids ourselves. There are ways that kids “test the waters” with the opposite sex.If we make fairly innocent actions into criminal behavior we are making more criminals. Send them to the principle’s office for a good talking too and then give them detention for a couple weeks. If this went on when I was in school, over half the kids would be in prison! Let’s get real here–I’m sure some of this is motivated by a suing mentality. You know, Let’s sue because Susie didn’t like to be touched and that nasty boy spanked her. That’s nuts. Make the punishment fit the crime, also the age range. If he was an adult walking down the street slapping strange women on the rear, he might get some counseling for weird behavior. These kids are merely trying to grow up. Don’t criminalize “growing up” behavior. Call it one of life’s lessons.
July 25, 2007 at 7:20 am
Professional athletes do it all the time
July 25, 2007 at 7:22 am
Yes, it is wrong! To invade someone’s bodily space without their permission, is wrong.. Disrespect for a woman starts out innocently, ie: slappin a girl on their butt. Men beat their wives and kick their dogs because they can and many have no respect for a woman or a dog as important. If the kid slapped my butt I would have hit him back and not for the fun of it. KEEP YOUR HANDS TO YOURSELF! That’s were they belong not fondling a woman for the fun of it. You’ve got to be kidding.
July 25, 2007 at 7:36 am
This is abuse of process/ It is also a failure of the school system to advise students as to what constitutes unacceptable behavior. If there was a “butt slap day” and lots of kids were doing it, then were was the principal and where were the guidance teachers and where were the teachers themselves. Don’t adults stand in the halls during change of classes, don’t adults supervise the cafeteria?
July 25, 2007 at 7:39 am
I believe that we need to be more focus on the sex offenders that are repeating crimes on children over and over again, and not children who behave inappropriately. Let parents be parents, the laws are meant for serious offenders, not children who need to learn boundaries. I am so sick of hearing how a pedophiles get out of prison only to repeat his offense on another child, while the systems keeps putting our young men in prison, sentencing them to probation, or forcing them to enter a plead when it’s really the parents who need to teach their children how to behave. Simple is just simple and stupid is just stupid and this case is just stupid.
July 25, 2007 at 7:39 am
BULL CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!
*My P.E. Teacher
*Basketball Coach
*Football coaches
*Football team
*Im Varsity Football Manager and they Slap Butts and say good job go gettem
*The girls and guys in our grade mess around and do it to
*Our teachers would be f#$@% off at you because we wouldnt have any kids in our school
Boy if i was your mom id be ashamed of you
thats the best crime you have why waste time on a playful gag
when you can be prosecuting a guy thats murdsering,robbing and stelling
Am i wrong if so someone e-mail me at
BullriderwanttaB@aol.com
July 25, 2007 at 8:03 am
this is crazy and being blown out of control. the boys should have been given a punishment from school officals not the police. what is happening to our schools? the boys in my school did this to girls all the time when i was growing up and none of them went to jail maybe sent to the principals office and a day in school dention. they are just experiencing growing up and sexuality someone should have just given them some counseling and told them that’s not the way to approach someone they like and teach them about growing up and explain to them what sex really is come on their hormones are raging and they think it’s cool to hit the girls on their butts and some of the girls might like it because they may think he likes her who knows what kids think now days but they don’t understand so we as parents and adults have to help them. i think it was just playful and no one should go to jail.
July 25, 2007 at 8:10 am
I can’t believe that “officials” are so ready to destroy a couple of young boys lives. As usual, people forget to make allowances. This “no tolerance laws” are crazy. People don’t want to take time to think. The boys need repremanded and then to get on with their lives!
July 25, 2007 at 8:13 am
Boy, you guys really have problems in the Ol’ USA if kids smacking each other on the butt is a criminal offence. Unfortunately, a lot of what you guys do eventually reaches ‘God’s Country’ down here in Australia, so I’d better be prepared. I can’t believe that butt whacking is a crime, but carrying around a magnum or semi auto hand gun or rifle isn’t. Do you guys think that maybe you have your priorities wrong? Never heard of a school massacre where the kids were smacked to death. Thank God for the ‘Land Downunder’.
Frank.
July 25, 2007 at 8:15 am
This whole thing is absolutely ridiculous! Kids do things that are inappropriate because they are learning right from wrong. When I was in school there was the same kind of things going on and nobody ever got arrested for it. They were punished in school and by their parents. This is no different than the elementary school student that got expelled for kissing a girl. These people are supposed to teach our kids, not blame them and arrest them for such a small offence. What happened to common sense?
July 25, 2007 at 8:18 am
No one should be touched by another without permission. Normally a girl would slap a boy in the face for such an act. If that would not cure the problem a boyfriend should take action. If no boyfriend then the father should cure the problem ; if no father then the law needs to solve the situation…..
July 25, 2007 at 8:30 am
Exactly when is it wrong to touch someone else inproperly? When you are 18 or 21 or 58? Is this the message we want to send? It is not okay to touch some else at any age. Should we wait until children are 18 or 21 or 58 to teach them this? And if not their parents then who should teach them this?
July 25, 2007 at 8:41 am
Yah, condemning them for life as sex abuser is surely excessive but an appropriate punishment should be ordered just to make them realize that they’ve been wrong and give example to other teenagers.
July 25, 2007 at 8:46 am
This is just another act of the government going overboard. the time to learn what is appropriate and what is not is during your youth. i am not approveing thier action in the least. In fact I believe that they sould be Punished by both their parents and the school.
It is hard to believe that the parents have lost the right to give a child a good spanking and replaced it with the government giving out the punishment. I believe that if these boys go to jail or get parole their is a chance that may parents will label them as “bad kids” and will then have to find a group of different freind that may be much less law abiding then his current.
July 25, 2007 at 8:53 am
i’m wondering what the statute of limitations is on such a crime. i’d like to file charges against Tony B. for pulling my pigtails in 5th grade (in 1955). am i too late?
July 25, 2007 at 9:02 am
We’re getting a little draconian and there will be a price to pay. People need to wake up, you don’t need the long arm of the law for every incident in your life. They truly don’t care about your well being, if so things of this nature would never come to this magnitude in the press. Personally I’m appalled at the inability of people to handle their petty and individual day to day consequences of life without yelling for the law. You like Totalitarianism, it will be here soon. These trivial discords are what teachers and school staff are supposed to handle. In my time this would have been seen as a silly act of youth, today we over analyze and tear one another apart for simple misjudgements. In this case the supposed victim wasn’t even offended let alone harmed and isn’t that what the law was intended to do, give recourse for a harm done, not might, possibly or could have. Wake up folks.
July 25, 2007 at 9:03 am
WOW…what happened to parents teaching their children appropriate behavior? Has the school system lost all control over the children in their schools?
What these boys did was inappropriate, but wouldn’t it serve the boys and the families involved better to give them a “lesson” in sexual harassment. Maybe one of the classes that corporate America uses to teach their employees appropriate and inappropriate behavior? How about accidental touching? Should we label everyone whose ever accidentally bumped into another person as a sex offender?
C’mon, make the punishment fit the crime…a few hours watching sexual harassment videos and a couple of weeks of after school detention, maybe a couple of week of grounding and the boys will have gotten the message.
July 25, 2007 at 9:07 am
The school officials and police officer shouldbe ashamed of the mess they have caused. They should have been able to professional resolve this ago old boy chase girl mischief. People are going to start looking at the sex offender register as a joke if this type of thing is consider a “Sex Crime”.
July 25, 2007 at 9:09 am
Shades of the Puritan days. Talk about an over reaction Whats next ? Burning our children at the stake for what amounts to childish pranks. Should they be punished ?? Yes! Some sensitivity instruction perhaps some detention or even possibly some community service. All these people who want blood, need to look inward and reflect on some of mistakes THEY made during their childhood years. We all learn by making mistakes each and every one of us. The point is to learn and move onward and upward not downward and backward. These boys could be yours. If one reads the articles closely the girls admitted they were doing the pranks also, shouldn’t they be punished too ?
Where is the equality in that and who are the real sick here people anyway ???? I submit to you its certainly not the children! We experienced a similar incident with our daughter, we spoke to the boys parents, the incident was put to rest and the boys actions corrected by his parents. The children are now in their 20’s well adjusted and friends. Life is not always this simple yes but thats where things should begin. I personally thing these young men have recognised the error of their ways let them move on
July 25, 2007 at 9:11 am
There are boys who have serious problems and need help and then there are boys who are just stupid, and the schools and authorities need to be able to tell the difference. When I was in school, many years ago, boys thought it was fun to snap the back of girls bras. None of these boys ended up being rapists or deviates, but by todays standards they would have been labeled sexual predators. People in postions of authority had better hope that stupidity never becomes a crime. The parents should talk to them, maybe even ground them, but beyond that the court system should build a bridge and get over it.
July 25, 2007 at 9:11 am
If we spank the child we go to jail. If we don’t spank the child they go to jail. We just can’t win can we. Frank you are right the USA must have some real problems, it’s called over control.
July 25, 2007 at 9:12 am
In my middle school in the 70’s girls were “felt up” regularly and I don’t mean a swat on the butt. That was sexual harassment. The butt swat behavior is inappropriate just as an intentional slap or punch. Any form of intentional force an another in my children’s school is reason for suspension, not life long labeling as a sex offender. The victims have a right to demand justice but they need to come forward and do the right thing. These girls were not raped. They were not violated in the way girls in my school were. What about the girls who confessed that they slapped boys butts. Why aren’t they being prosecuted or for that fact repremanded or punished?
July 25, 2007 at 9:17 am
You can’t say for someone else who has been the victim of the act that the act of someone slapping her was only “harmless play” and it is up to the rest of the world to bend over backwards and give people who “playfully slap” others lots of leeway for what they should not have been doing. There are young people (especially females but whenever it has happened to a male it applies too) who have experienced sexual abuse through family, clergy, teachers coaches or other adults or individuals and being slapped is a traumatic reminder of being sexually used, and fondled, and overpowered, and shocked, and disrespected. Who’s to say that jail time for the offender is “too much”? It may not be anything close to what the victim is experiencing. Young people should be taught that playing games to “sexually tease” others can have repercussions and rightfully so because you can’t be assuminmg that other people take such things as “fun mischief.” You could be further emotionally harming someone. People should not complain that the law is getting involved. It could prevent a situaion in which someone who gets slapped comes back to school with a gun and shoots everyone. This incident of a kid getting jail time should be looked at in the right context. Too bad it is something “disproportionate” as some people think, but it will serve as a lesson. Other people will hear about it and be more careful and it should help keep someone from thoughtlessly slapping someone and ending up in jail. It is just like the threat of getting fined for jaywalking keeps people from crossing the street thoughtlessly and getting themselves killed and a car all messy.
By the way, how many people would rather be the person who slapped someone on the butt uninvitedly and got jail time, or be the person who got slapped on the butt and was humiliated and objectified?
July 25, 2007 at 9:18 am
This is absolutely absurd!!! My daughter was molested at age 3 and the man got 6 months in a county jail. These poor children are facing jail time for something that happens everyday at school. I am not saying what they did was right adn they should face some sort of punishment but jail time is going a little too far. I can not believe this, it is just more proof that the system SUCKS!!! Punishment for those who deserve it are minimal while thos who do not quite deserve such rash punishments are getting life without parole! What can we do to stop this sort of thing???
July 25, 2007 at 9:20 am
Good grief - sounds to me like its just adolescent kid stuff….NOT A CRIME. Is it a crime for kids to just be kids today. I mean its not like they were raping these girls and the girls were doing butt slapping to others too…I think the mother of the girl that said it was a CRIME should put her girl in private school for girls and make sure she has her chastity belt chained and locked. [shaking head] Can you say OVERKILL??
Thats whats wrong with society today, they focus on the stupid stuff and not get to the people that are the REAL PROBLEMS - the judges and juries that allow these buckeheads to run free to kidnap, kill and rape our kids.
July 25, 2007 at 9:20 am
What is wrong with this world?? We let murderers live in a place where they get 3 meals a day, can work out, watch tv, play games, and even work…then they get out of jail to get back into society? Why, so they can murder again? No lesson learned there….and now 13 yr old boys are being just that….BOYS….and instead of the school taking care of it, they got ARRESTED????????? You have got to be kidding me!!!!! Absolutely rediculous. So what we are saying to our children is be afraid to do anything at all….don’t touch anyone, don’t even look at anyone the wrong way….but whenever you want, break the real law and have the life in jail. Come on! We seriously need to check our system!
July 25, 2007 at 9:29 am
L.M, Get real! I’ve been in both situations and there is a big difference. The person the abused did a great deal of damage and I would have loved to see him convicted or worse. The kids that slapped or touch my butt may have made me feel humiliated for a moment but I didn’t want them sent to jail for it.
July 25, 2007 at 9:29 am
Well being the father of a young ladie, I would be very upset if the school did nothing. For example, this really did happen in an upstate NY school system.
A friend of my god daughter was getting her bra snapped a few times a day by a male student. This went on for 3 months. She reported it to those in charge. She was told that it is “just stuff boys do”. She also kept a list of those she spoke to about it. She got tired of it one day and turned and punched him in the nose. Breaking his nose and upper jaw. The school suspended her for 4 weeks and had her arrested for assult. The outcome was everything was dropped by the state, the boy was charged with sexual assult, and the school paid out 6 figures for not dealing with the problem. The boy was not required to register as a sexual offender. But was/ is on probation for 3.5 years.
July 25, 2007 at 9:32 am
I feel horrible sorry for the boys. As everyone before me said…it is not ok what they did, however, it is not criminal. A DA is willing to ruin a 13 year old guy’s life over this? How about going out there and getting the real criminal? How about making sure the killers and the real sex offenders go beind bars? Why not drop this absurdity and move on to what really matters. And as for the parent of one of the girls, who said that her daughter was sexually abused…how about you talk to someone who got their daughter really abused and then burried alive? A swat is sexual abuse to you? What about when your daughter touches a boy’s bottom? what is that? How about go to inner city schools and see what is done and then reflect on the way you say things in public. People come to your senses and see what really matters, leave the boy and the family alone, for that they have done nothing criminal that deserves up to 10 years in jail.
My prayers are with Cory and his family.
July 25, 2007 at 9:34 am
An OVER ZEALOUS prosecutor, inappropriate conduct needing attention by the school…prosecutor to eager to ruin lives forever!
July 25, 2007 at 9:35 am
FIrst of all - since when is the butt - through the clothing - on the gluteous maximus considered intimate sexual contact. If that were the case- could prosecute every woman - or man for that matter - who rubbed up against me in an elevator.
Secondly - the legal terminology here is crap. Using the term VICTIM is self serving for the accusor - which to my understanding there actually is NO accuser - it was a domino effect - a teacher SAW something - the principal assed it to the cops and the cops determined that the BUTT is an intimate sexual body part. Cops pat down butts all the time - male upon female - if its intimate ought they not do that any more. THis is CRAP - plain and simple and if this gets to trial - and they have a decent defense attorney - and perhaps security footage from that school showing not only that this is common practice with all students - but also that teachers etal observed this in the passt - man are you gonna have major law suit or more likely 100s of them from ambulance chasing attornies who will see a gold mine in an innocent act
One question - ought we consider if the judge - court commissioner - DA or any of those cops EVER slapped a lady on the butt. What would the reasonable person assume to that question. These COPS are idiots for taking them in - the DA should have diffused this timebomb at the beginning and not gotten it to this point and the DA should insist the terms Victim and “sexual” not be permitted until it has been decided to go to trial. If it does go to trial - the families should seek out a mean ass defense attorney who will work over ALL the kids in that school and determine if others did this - and if the girls themselves ever did it also to boys and if so make damned sure they inundate the DA and court system with 100s of cases - thats justice - whats good for the goose is good for that gander. This is absurd and an abuse of the legal system from the get go.
July 25, 2007 at 9:37 am
Pretty soon we’ll have to send our kids to school with their arms tied to they’re backs. The parents of the girls and the school officals who are pressing the charges obviuosly have nothing better to do with their lives but ruin the lives of these children who were just playing around. I don’t even think a 13 yr old even knows what sexual harassment is. Worry about the real rapists and sexual offenders that are doing the real harm and let children be children. Detention would have been sufficient for those boys. Give me a break!!!!
July 25, 2007 at 9:44 am
If i was the parent of cory i would have sued the school by now for their extremly unprofessional way to handle this. And i think she should sue the school for that, for puting her 13 year old child through so much without even seeking less drastic measures. i mean, come on…arent we living in a litigous type of society where everyone blames other people besides themselves? and where a DA wants to keep busy with nonsense because they are not confident enough to deal with real crimes?
July 25, 2007 at 9:46 am
What I find really disturbing is that this is initially and inherently (even though it can be definately be said to be a “unisex thing” in a way) a matter of men deciding for women what sexual harrassment is or is not.
July 25, 2007 at 9:51 am
In one of the articles I read about this, the one boy had been touching a girl’s breast as well as slapping other kids’ behinds. I believe that there should have been a consequence and all the facts should be told. As with other things, it is easy to jump on the bandwagon based on partial information. IF the kids were playfully hitting each other, the school should suspend them or provide a consequence so that young boys learn that there are limits to what they do. If there was more to it, similar consequences should follow. I don’t want to make these kids feel like heroes or as if THEY are the victims.
July 25, 2007 at 9:54 am
I am obviously a girl. I think it is ‘normal’ that a young teen slaps a girls behind. Although a girl may be uncomfortable with it, it should be dealt with in the school. They boys should be warned. Detention. Something. But the legal system? Shame on the school for not being able to handle something so minute. I bet those girls are not so innocent anyway. If this is how our legal system is then guess what, I am going after the cop that pulled me over and said I was hot, and the principal that told me I was pretty, and the 30 boys in school who slapped my but, and the boss that sent me flowers. I am also going after Holly wood for making it ‘appropriate’ and ‘acceptable’ for all boys/men to slap a behind. Oh and for my parents alls those spankings I got were too inappropriate.
What has our world come too?? I am ashamed.
July 25, 2007 at 9:57 am
h
July 25, 2007 at 9:59 am
I think “Behmang ” really put it in the most appropriate perspective. The ones who did wrong are being made into some sort of martyrs for “freedom” or heroes. If they are suffering more than their actions had caused, it is too bad. As I expressed elsewhere about this matter, It is like the incident of police shooting a grafitti artist some years back. It was a bit of an overreaction but then again society and the world did not lose someone who did wonderful and positive things that the world benifitted from. Worry less about the people who made trouble (in the first place) and more about the people whom were given trouble.
July 25, 2007 at 10:01 am
I totally agree with what jenna said previously. It is unfortunate that it happened to such a young boy to be made an example of how idiotic, dysfuctional and disappointing our legal system is turning out to be. Michael Jackson clearly abused kids and is free and you are going to make this guy a sex offender? It makes me sick. It makes me feel ashamed to be american, what are we becoming…what is happening to our society and to us. Have we forgotten how to be human? Are people nowdays born 45 year olds? They dont remember they were kids one time in their life?
July 25, 2007 at 10:03 am
They deserve everything they get! What they did was wrong-they new that-It’s Sexual Harassment people. What is wrong with you? Maybe if they are punished now, they won’t grow up to be Ted Bundy’s!!
July 25, 2007 at 10:05 am
I say give each of the girls father one swing at the boys butts boys. They should make a public appology and be supended form school a wile. Thay are 13 and did something stupid, its not like they scared these girls for life. But with absurd criminal charges like this these boys lives or over before they even start. You can’t tell me that the parents of these girls agree with what is happening to the boys.
July 25, 2007 at 10:06 am
This is what happens when we only see in black & white and lose perspective and the inabilit to see any gray areas. The schools are so afraid of being sued that they go too far in the way they handle all of their discipline.
This is really sad, epecially since I just saw that a Liberian man in MD was not even tried after having sex with a 7 yr old.
These are young boys. Why do we insist on no tolerance of any kind for these small infractions, yet we continue to allow the real pedophles and abusive people to live without repercussion.?
As the mother of three young men, I pray that one innocent incident never leads to the bizarre interpretations of the school system & prosecutors in this country.
July 25, 2007 at 10:07 am
I believe this situation shows just how our judicial system is responding to social exageration of the intentions of human nature. I don’t condone or say that what the boys did was right , it was completely inappropriate . However , I don’t believe it was anything that should deem these boys sex offenders or even criminals on any level. Fact is this is a failure in this country’s moral structure formed from popular social believe.
In other words this a is a governmental response to a highly diverse set of social standards. The rules have only changed because there are people who are stupid enough to think that the boys did was a felony. I think that this exageration is one of many , and I’m sure it will get worse. Bottom line people are people and will always do things that someone dislikes but should it be criminal simply because a few people think it’s wrong. Nobody is perfect and you can’t please everyone.
July 25, 2007 at 10:07 am
I am so disappointed. What is wrong with our legal system, our prosecutors, when they can not use common sense? We constantly hear about overcrowded prisons - duh - this would be why. They can’t catch the real criminals, and so they use the letter of the law to demonize those they can catch, and then the real criminals get paroled. What the heck? We have Glenarlow Wilson sitting in jail for being given oral sex (one of many) because he was 17 and the female was 15. If every young man who has had sex with a female under the age of 16 raised his hand, and was prosecuted, our nation would collapse. If every young man who has snapped a bra, or smacked a tail, was prosecuted, again we would have no workforce left. Our children need to learn, in the process we guide them. We don’t send them to jail for biting or cursing, we talk to them, punish them. We are their parents - not the District attorney, not the police. When it is convenient - they tell us the children are our responsibility, but then they offer our children free confidential birth control without parental consent or notification. These people want it both ways. What a waste of our taxpayer dollars, and their time. I certainly see enough pictures of missing children, why don’t they go find our missing children, and put the real criminals behind bars. I do not want to look at a sex offender registry and see and adolescent who is not a predator, I want to see the 40 year old who has been preying on our babies.
July 25, 2007 at 10:08 am
THIS IS CRAZY !!! WHAT IS THE MATTER WITH THIS WORLD ALL THEY THINK OF IS SEXUAL THING WHEN THE KIDS ARE HAVING THEIR FUN. THOSE CHARGES ARE HARSH AND TOO STRONG FOR THE BOYS - THEY ARE STILL KIDS NOT ADULT. I THINK FINE OR SOMETHING ELSE BUT NOT JUVENILE DETENTION OR JAIL IS NOT GOING TO SOLVE THIS - IT IS GOING TO HARM THEM IN SO MANY WAYS AND WILL NEVER BE NORMAL AGAIN IF THEY ARE IN JAIL.
DISTRICT ATTORNEY OR JUDGE: IF THIS WAS YOUR SON OR GRANDSON - WOULD YOU DO THIS HAVE THEM TO GO JAIL AND BE PUT IN SEX OFFENDER WEBSITE ???? (KNOWING THAT IT WAS THEIR INTENTION)….
July 25, 2007 at 10:09 am
L.M u seriously need to stop with this postings. U are being unfair and harsh towards what happened. I mean, you never went through adolescence? if you really think that the boys deserve what is happening to them, then throw the first stone. This is a matter that could have been resolved within the school by the teachers, and the principal and the parents of everyone involved. If you think the boys are clearly sex offenders then there is something wrong with you and the way you lead your life. Look inside of you and find some humanity and imagine that being your kid treated that way. But hey, it is easy to judge when you dont have to turn the knife the other way around and for a second imagine yourself in that position.
July 25, 2007 at 10:10 am
What has happened to our society when stupid, but “typical”, juvenile behavior is taken to this level.
July 25, 2007 at 10:18 am
Heck, they are little white boys. Slap them on the wrist and let them go home like you usually do. Now, if they were black or hispanic I’d say lock them up and throw away the key because,it is what you usually do. Thank you.
July 25, 2007 at 10:24 am
Well, here we go…. A teacher’s Aid sees a perfectly normal activity, and decides to make a hero of herself. If she had not, the father of one of the girls would not have been told, which resulted in HIS being offended, and so claims is daughter was offended.
Truth be known, there was NO OFFENSE THERE! Girls have been putting up with ‘inappropriate’ actions from boys since there have been boys and girls. And the GIRLS can be as nasty as the boys. Just no body ever complains about that.
A couple of days’ detention at most is what was called for. These kids have committed NO CRIME!!! In order for there to be a crime there must be KNOWLEDGE of the crime, and INTENT to commit the crime. Neither exists here! They are only 13 years old, for crying out loud….. Shurely they do not deserve to lose their futures to a moment’s fun with a practice many others engage in.
I wonder what that teacher’s aid has been up to that she needs to direct attention to someone else?
Randy…….
July 25, 2007 at 10:25 am
I have a 17 year old boy, who has been being investigated for over 5 months by the state police in MI for allegedly having a consensual relationship with a 15 year old. He has been charged with felony criminal sexual conduct and is facing 15 years in prison and 25 years on the sex offender registry. I know it sounds ludicrous, but it is really happening. The female in question states clearly “she was all for it and wanted to do everything” the mother states that she took her daughter to put her on birth control and found out that her daughter was having sex. These are written statements in the reports.
How can you take your daughter to put her on birth control, then go to the police when she is doing what she needs the birth control for?
How can the prosecutors even begin to follow up on this. I have spent countless sleepless nights, thousands of dollars in defense, and my poor son has nearly had a total nervous breakdown. He had to go to school day after day, just a teenager himself, and face all the teenagers asking questions. The police visiting his friends to find out what “hearsay” they knew. They have lied and devastated his young life. He has a college scholarship, and I don’t know if he will be able to use it because, the law has decided to pursue this one case.
Is teenage experimentation really worth all these criminal charges? Aren’t we harming our young people more by demonizing their sexual behavior?
I am broken hearted, and broke now, and I don’t know what is wrong with our society?
July 25, 2007 at 10:27 am
So, when does horseplay become inappropriate behavior? And, when does inappropriate behavior transgress the privacy or rights of others? I can’t think of a better time for these young men to learn this.
July 25, 2007 at 10:28 am
BRADLEY BERRY NEEDS TO EVALUATE THIS CASE AND REALIZE THESE ARE BOYS AND NOT ADULTS AND USE COMMON SENSE NOT THE LETTER OF THE LAW. APPARENTLY COMMON SENSE RUNS SHORT IN THIS AREA.
July 25, 2007 at 10:36 am
It is so sad what this country has come to. i suppose the next thing is boys cant talk to girls because someone won’t like the way their talked to. so very sad.
July 25, 2007 at 10:44 am
I have a daughter myself & though I would be highly upset if another child came up smacking her on the bottom, I do not feel that making these children register as sex offenders is appropriate. To even put them in a juvinile jail for a period of time (other than the 5 days they spent in there) would be highly inappropriate as well. I believe that the parents & the school should handle this w/o all of the media involved. Really, this is being blown out of proportion and may open doors to even worse things for these boys & possibly the girls that this has happened too. The judge alone should be ashamed- Like there arent thousands of “real sex offenders” still roaming around– that he has to target children & possibly give such a stiff sentance for smacking someones bottom… Helloooo this is happened in a Junior High School NOT an office setting!
These children can still be molded & influenced . Do you really think that by sending them to a juvinile jail would influence them in a more positive way?? If so, you are sadly mistaken.
July 25, 2007 at 10:45 am
I dont know what the problems with LM or Dawn are but they need to check and make sure they have any humanity left….the boys were wrong, the princial was wrong, the police were wrong, and the DA was wrong. I was a victim of very real sexual abuse and I can assure you this doesn’t even come close to qualifying as such. This was clearly inapropriate adolescent behavior and should have been dealt with in the school and family setting.
July 25, 2007 at 10:45 am
I can’t believe Rhonda Pope, one of the girl’s mothers actually feels that this is a crime. It appears Ms. Pope does not want to be bothered teaching her daughter how to handle life’s problems in a normal way. She would rather call the police in and save herself the trouble of having to be a parent by training her daughter to recognize and deal with what is inappropriate behavior. Mrs, Pope is either a very lazy mother or a woman with a big big chip on her shoulder. Shame on her! mitchrick@comcast.net
July 25, 2007 at 10:46 am
— an FYI for the defense. The Texas Rangers baseball team has a commercial wherein everyone slaps everyone else on the butt in what is implied to be a comradire gesture. Perhaps the prosecution should contact the Texas Atty Gnl and request Texas file sexual misconduct charges on the ad agency, the actors and the team. This sounds an awfull lot like the Duke Univ. Lacross scandal, don’t you think???
July 25, 2007 at 10:47 am
this happened to my son when he was in the 2nd grade! he was suspended from school. My son is now 15. he’s the most decent person you could know. He is slow to even find an interest in girls and I know that at 2nd grade he wasnt feeling sexual toward the girl he slapped on the butt. He is a hard worker, he’s honest to a fault. He basically a shy kid but found an outlet by associating with the class clowns. when goofing around on the bus a girl said she went to tell on him..while she walked past his seat he tried to stop her and slapped her ont he butt. He was told this was sexual harrassment. i’m glad that he learned the seriousness of ANY behavior like this; better earlier than later. CRIMINAL….NOT. Dont even get me started about what GIRLS get away with on this subject though………………… I feel sorry for this boy that he is being treated FAR TOO harshly. This should simply be an opportunity to let him know that this subject is one stay clear of in the future…its not a joke. Criminal though…pleaseeeeeeeeeeee. They are making an EXAMPLE ouf of a child….
July 25, 2007 at 10:53 am
The boys behavior is inappropriate, but not a crime that should be in the courts. I have two teenage girls the same age as the boys and the school needs to get a better handle on issues going on within its walls. Kids today play many adolescence games in school that are rude and incentive to others. I personally feel the teacher’s aid and the faculty at that school should be held responsible for the actions of their students. My wife and I work full time and are active members in our kids school. I feel its very important to be an active member because I hear my children’s stories and speak up when issues bother me.
This issue is now a waist of the tax payers dollar.
July 25, 2007 at 10:59 am
This is so crazy!! This is another case of our justice system & education system spending to much time on things they “can” fix or take care of easily as opposed to I don’t know–keeping true criminals in jail so they don’t murder a Doctors family!! These boys would get the message with in school suspension, classes regarding their behavior at their parents expense & Saturday campus clean up. Now they are in front of the media & getting tons of attention..hmmmm
To the Mom who thinks this is a “crime”.
No, this is what we in the old days called foolish boys who would have gotten a whoopin by the principal. I have two daughters & I can assure you I would not be happy either, but I would also be realistic & I would make sure the boys personally apologized to my daughter and maybe some of my yard work could get done also. Let’s be constructive in teaching our children–don’t just throw away the key.
GET REAL
July 25, 2007 at 11:07 am
To Maxine,
Your comments are more inappropriate then these boys behavior. Your attitude is the reason we are in this mess. It was not a color issue, though everyone wants to make it that. So from a person other than “white”. Knock it off–I will speak for myself thank you very much…idiot
July 25, 2007 at 11:09 am
3 day suspension is appropriate, of course not jail, HOWEVER, the boys are not the victims, would the parents of the boys be so quick to dismiss if someone say a teacher or some older boys had been the ones to touch/slap/or fondle THEIR boys. they would prosecute of course and want justice. while this is a juvenile prank it still warrants disipline. what would they want if their child had been violated.?
July 25, 2007 at 11:11 am
This is absolutely ridiculous! Why do we turn normal adolescent behavior into something dirty and criminal? These are thrteen year old boys! They are almost expected to behave like this. Sure, if a 25-year-old man slapped a co-worker’s butt as he passed her in the hallway, by all means, prosecute him. But 13-year-olds?! We really need to re-evaluate our system. This is getting out of hand!!!
July 25, 2007 at 11:13 am
Do school teachers and principals have no authority over their students that they have to call the police about juvenile jerkiness?
The boy leaving court looked pretty smug and without shame in the newsphoto. All that media attention - all on him and his buddy. His parents are distraught. Their son doesn’t know what he’s in for in jail or on probation, and he and the lawyers will cost them a lot of money and grief.
The girls are either loving the attention (”Hey, I must be sexy if some guy wants to slap my bum.”) or hiding under the pillows. (”They must think I’m a slut or they would’ve respected my right to be touched only by people I want to touch me.”) Why couldn’t the girls slap the boys faces and tell them to back off? That being in the same class doesn’t give them the right to play pattycake before asking the girl if it’s all right.
If the kids are not bullies - and unpermitted bum slapping is a sign of the slapper controlling the slappee, therefore bullying and harrassment - they would back off with an apology when the slappee tells him/her off. If the slapper keeps doing it, then the injured party should go to the principal and have the slapper disciplined by the school. The police should be called in only if the problem becomes violent.
The school probably thought the gesture was getting out of control. A lot of kids were bumslapping other kids (as a rough form of tag if not a sexual play) and it was interfering with schoolwork.
Most high school sexplay is semi-clean horseplay but if overindulged could be a sign of something twisted. A man in my area went from looking up girls’ skirts in high school and in the library to raping women near bus-stops and murdering his wife’s sister and two other young girls. I think if he had been put into a psychiatric program in his teens, those girls may not have died so traumatically. And there was the man who molested those Amish girls because of a sexual incident in his adolescence.
July 25, 2007 at 11:15 am
OK… it is time to put the whole football team in jail… coaches too!
“Butt slapping after a great on the field play” …
July 25, 2007 at 11:16 am
I think these charges are absurd! This should have been dealt with at a school level. These are not criminal acts, especailly if this is a “norm” at the school and both sexes are doing this.
July 25, 2007 at 11:20 am
The United States has taken sexual abuse to a ridicules level. It is equivalent to the Salem Witch hunt days and having the “scarlet letter” placed on you forever. When I was 16 years old in high school, I often had sex with the girls I dated, the girls wanted it too, they had surging hormones also. We were both under age since most high school kids are under 18. Do schools now need to post warning signs that sex with a classmate could result in jail time? Come on now! Is the next step issuing sex licenses? How about a drivers permit first?
As an adult, I would never be a teacher of kids or be a mentor in the Big Brother program. The reason being, kids today have power over adults like never before. They can say you abused them and ruin your life, even if not true. Kids are now using this tactic with each other, which is sad. All you need to do is give a kid a hug, and you could end up in jail. You can not win in court when you are up against a kid’s false testimony. I have chosen to avoid the possible trouble, and as a result society will have one fewer excellent child mentor.
The rest of the world laughs at the United States constant obsession with sex. I laugh at us too, we place too much attention on our groins in this country.
July 25, 2007 at 11:55 am
Here’s my question: Why are the boys being punished and not the girls? They were running around slapping rears as well. Is it because “girls are just more touchy feely than boys so it’s okay” or maybe “well it’s kinda cute when they do it”. This seems to be a common trend. Look at the overall public attitude toward pretty, young teachers that had sex with their students. What if those teachers had been men, or unattractive women? There would have outrage! The D.A. would have been going apesh!t and made sure they were locked up for life! This is a very similar senario. The behavior was inappropriate, but it should be handled within the school and there is no reason it should be blown out of proportion. THEY ARE KIDS!! This is typical behavior of children that age. I know a lot of guys in middle & high school that would do this same sort of thing, and guess what? THEY AREN’T OUT RAPING PEOPLE!!
July 25, 2007 at 12:04 pm
I have to agree with Elmer I work in a high school and over the past 22 years I have seen inappropriate behavior from both immature boys and girls but….. I have seen the little girls use the threat of false sexual abuse charges as a weapon as well as seing them actually make false allegations for the sole purpose of punishing another, I have seen this done to both other students as well as school employees. Unfortunatly this has caused a deep skeptisism on my part whenever I am told of a case of so called sexual harrasement or abuse. One really stupid incident happened to my son when he was 12. He had a medical problem resulting in delayed growth and puberty and there was a girl on his bus who delighted in teasing him calling him munchkin, umpa loompa etc. This was all reported to the female bus driver repeatedly and she failed to do anything about it. I also had a call in to the counselor but had not yet heard from him. One day this girl says to the bus in general that she bets my son will never have any hair on his balls… at which point my son responds with yeah and you’re a fat ugly bitch. guess what.. he was thrown off the bus for 10 days for his innapropriate behavior suspended from school for 5 days for profanity (Should have been) but when they tried to charge him with sexual harrasement I went ballistic and took it all the way to the school board. He was not charged and the girl was not punished at all. The boys in the story were wrong but I have to say that I see that very behavior every day and I believe it should be dealt with at the school level and across the board, not just aimed at 1 sex.
July 25, 2007 at 12:25 pm
It seems the consensus is that the punishment so far for these boys has been very extreme and I agree. It’s sad that there are some people who’d like to see children locked away in prison for something any mischevious boy or girl would probably do. Yes it was wrong, yes they deserve a punishment such as school detention or suspension, but to be in jail overnight, none the less 5 days is completely absurd.
I have spent four years in prison for NON-SEX RELATED CRIMES, and the thought of holding two young boys in jail for five days for this act is sickening. I didn’t even spend five days in jail after beeing arrested, and my crimes were federal felonies.
What these boys did was wrong, and I do not condone it. And it undoubtedbly should be very important to focus on the trauma these young girls could experience. But rest assured, the trauma that these boys endured being locked away will far exceed the trauma these young girls felt by getting there butt slapped.
For the parents to feel anger and want to see these children prosecuted for their acts is somewhat understandable. But, it is very frightening to see some people here seem to have so much anger in them to want to punish these kids to extremes for these acts. It makes you wonder who these people really are?
July 25, 2007 at 12:50 pm
Butt slapping especially to girls gives them a sexual reaction at least to most. At first it’s a embarrassment but later it kindles a warmth.
July 25, 2007 at 12:53 pm
Wow!!! What mixed comments: some I agreed with, some I didn’t.
I am a counselor in a middle school (grades 6 to 8)with over 25 years experience working with “kids” from K to 12th Grade. I teach “Life”, preferring Reality Therapy (which means that I don’t sit around saying “ummm’, “yea’; uh huh”, or asking kids how they FEEL about something).
The boys were wrong; ALL of the kids involved in the ‘horse-play’ of slapping butts were wrong; but believe me, that seems minor to what usually takes place within our public schools throughout this country. Kids at MS or HS age can be pretty mean to each other with the verbal bullying that takes place: some of the nasty, mean comments have had a far more long-lasting effect than being slapped on the butt. Read the profiles about many of the school “shooters” : almost to a person they described how they were tormented, picked on or ostracized by school-mates through mean, vicious verbal attacks.
We live in a society in which it has become far too easy and acceptable to blame others for one’s behavior; it is too acceptable to not accept responsibility for one’s actions.
One of the REAL issues here is that the school adminstrator LACKED THE COURAGE to handle the situation as a school problem. It was passed on to the school resource officer to be handled as a criminal act. We also live in society in which “common sense” has been replaced by political correctness which has led further to idiotic or asinine (by the way, that word has Nothing to do with the body part in question) policies of ‘zero tolerance’. Many issues could be handled easily if people would just think and discuss what happened!!!
Society itself has changed; young people today do not believe that anything that they “DO” is wrong. There is little sense of morality or what is “right or wrong”. And we ALL are to blame for that!!!
July 26, 2007 at 7:26 am
L.M,
I don’t think that no one is really denying that the butt slapping was not a form of sexual misconduct. The matter that remains are when is a parent allowed to be a parent in disciplining their children and when does the law have the right to punish them. To what extend do we keep allowing other people who are not a part of the family structure to continue to influence the future of our children.
These boys without no doubt should get into trouble for their behavior, but we are not talking about children who are walking around with guns and planning on killing someone as you mentioned before. We are also not talking about an offense that has accrued over a period of six months and that has been documented for it to be some sort of mental disorder. I don’t think no one really wants to generalize that these boys are wrong. However, I do believe that when in dealing with the law and society there are more serious offenders are getting away with more than these two boys ever committed.
For example, why is it ok for a woman to have a sexual relationship with our sons and it’s viewed as ok. When a man committees the same offense then he does prison time. The world is full of bias behavior, and if when the world spends more time trying to determine the future of these boys instead of changing the laws for harsher punishment to serious offenders, then what does it really say about us. If it were me, I would see to it that these boys get counseling to determine their mental stability to try and see if they are nearly a threat as they are being perceived and if it is the case that then they need help if not, they need to be disciplined, punished by the parents and the schools not the court system. Like a said before this case is just stupid and no matter how many opinions are put out there, these two young boys have to deal with the over zealous acts of a vice principle, police office, truth is he needs to be doing the foot work in our streets if he is going to be determine the fate of children in this manner to the extent that he did.
July 27, 2007 at 10:16 pm
I just heard this story on TV, and I am concerned about the severity of the punishment as well as concerned about the actions of the kids. I’ve spent 21 years teaching high school and junior high students, and I honestly can say, yes, being required to register as sex offenders is a bit extreme for these two kids. That said, what the boys did certainly falls under the banner of sexual harassment, and they would have been suspended for a week or so at our school. Whether or not the girls minded the conduct is really beside the point. Most school handbooks have a passage about sexual harassment, inappropriate touching, etc., and if kids and parents would read them, they might save themselves a boatload of trouble.
One poster above said that this is normal teenage behavior. It has been many, many years since I was in high school and junior high myself, but I can’t remember any boy touching my butt. I was a normal kid who had close friends of both sexes, and we spent time together in and out of school. However, if a boy had slapped a girl’s butt in my grammar school, he would have received a few swats by the principal. Then he would have been paddled again by his dad or mom when he got home and dragged over to the girl’s house to apologize to her in front of both sets of parents. I should mention that he would also have been punched in the eye by the girl or her brother … and that would have been the end of it.
These kids should talk to the school counselor to make sure they understand why their actions were inappropriate. This includes any girls involved in the mischief, as they are just as guilty, if they encouraged it. Then the kids should be given some sort of appropriate community service to do. When it is done, that should be the end of it, as long as they don’t misbehave in that way again.
July 28, 2007 at 3:33 am
well she said (district attorney) these charges are life threating, life changing. well if she purse’s these chrages agianst these young boy’s it will be life changing. for them i can almost guarentee you one of these boy’s will wind up in prison for life if he is labeled as a sex ofender. i am not saying it is o.k to touch others in this manner but what up your a school. teach the childledren don’t destroy there life’s . so much to say but that is enough for now .
July 31, 2007 at 12:44 pm
The diversity issue seems to be important. The girls admitted to also slapping but. Thankfully, the feminists on this forum have only talked about how the girls were violated, the possibility that it was wrong for the girls themselves to slap but might have been raised by extreme right wing masculinist nuts. Thank goodness that diversity prevailed. It was not wrong for the girls to slap other girls or boys, of if boys slapped other boys since that could have been an expression of gay sensibilities. The only shame is that the male perps weren’t sufficiently sensitized to the fact that is wrong for their gender to slap but that they have to submit to the girls slapping them, as they did, in the future. The school and the justice system has shown a fine sensitivity to gender diversity, it is a shame that they couldn’t also demonstrate racial diversity; for example, punishing one ethnic group but not another for slapping. Nevertheless, this has been a good addition to the diversity experience in our schools.
August 6, 2007 at 1:08 am
It sounds like the American version of the Taliban.
Bradley Berry is obviously a over zealous ambitious idiot unfit to make any judgements in a case of real law. He should be ashamed. What if this were his son? would he apply the same harsh mentality. Betcha NOT!